That's why the SFF-TA-1002 connector is so important when paired with SFF-TA-1006 and SFF-TA-1007. Once that's the industry standard we'll see more dense rack servers and more variable composable infrastructure. My employer is about to launch something that sets the foundation for this. Gonna be rad. The 3" variables are just a stopgap in the composability roadmap; they're far to space inefficient in the long term.
yeah with flash prices supposed to be falling next year it would be nice to be able to build an all-flash prosumer class home server/NAS without the spaghetti of SATA and power cabling
Cabling does allow more flexibility in case design though, and also in using the slots for other things. If you want you can connect a 3.5" drive or 2.5" drive (SSD or mechanical) to the same port, which provides far more flexibility for consumer use/construction. If you want lots of flash storage, is there a problem loading up with PCIe drives or PCIe adapters for M2 devices?
I honestly don't think that'll happen this time. There are a lot of tech companies on board with Gen Z, and the trends in the industry are toward open systems. I'm hopeful that this will win out. Granted, at the consumer level it'll take 5-10 years, but I'd expect infrastructure level to be 2-3 years (based on my limited knowledge and speculation.)
It's never going to happen. M.2 is limited to x4, so nobody is going to make a consumer-oriented controller that supports x8, especially not with the transition to PCIe gen4 starting (sooner for SSD controllers than for x86 CPUs). Also, there are plenty of motherboards that offer x8/x4/x4 splits.
I'm with Billy on this, especially with the shift to NVMe and next gen media.Since NVMe doesn't use a separate controller, but goes through the CPU. I think eventually we'll see SFF-TA-1006 filter all the way down (they're about the same dimensions as M.2). Gen Z will solve the PCIe issue you mentioned. As they said in the article, a single Gen Z lane carries more bandwidth than PCIe3 (and 4, too).
NVMe SSDs don't need to connect through a host bus adapter like SAS and SATA SSDs. Everything needs a controller on the drive itself, but only PCIe SSDs can connect directly to the CPU.
All I hope is a next generation consumer storage cables (SATA successor) will be able to support both SATA and PCIe storage and includes power in the same cable at least for regular NVMe & SATA SSD's..
And to make it compact and tidy not like those stupid drive-side U.2 connectors.. or motherboad side PCIe Express slot.
IMO the sizes and connector should be standardized across server as well as workstation/desktops. That will bring the lowest pricing for all. Of course, we know that'll never happen...
You didn't think Intel could get away with "One Ruler to rule them all" did you? I'd think twice before fallowing Intel's lead in standards, they aren't nvidia, but they love nothing more than to own the market.
The window of opportunity for U.2 in the consumer space has closed. M.2 is good enough for almost all consumer storage needs, and U.2 isn't going to stick around forever in the datacenter.
And you already have M.2 without all the throttling. It's called M.2.
I understand that I'm probably in the minority here but I really wish they made hot swappable compact flash sized micro SSD's that are fast enough to saturate a USB 3.1 bus.
They really just need a fast external connection for servers so you separate cpu/memory from storage. And get rid of 1U/2U form factor! It's so inefficient for just about everything.
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RU482 - Friday, August 17, 2018 - link
too many options. this is why we can't have nice thingsdark4181 - Friday, August 17, 2018 - link
That's why the SFF-TA-1002 connector is so important when paired with SFF-TA-1006 and SFF-TA-1007. Once that's the industry standard we'll see more dense rack servers and more variable composable infrastructure. My employer is about to launch something that sets the foundation for this. Gonna be rad. The 3" variables are just a stopgap in the composability roadmap; they're far to space inefficient in the long term.edzieba - Friday, August 17, 2018 - link
I'd love to see this come to consumer devices, but I can't see see it getting around the legacy formfactor problem.wintermute000 - Friday, August 17, 2018 - link
yeah with flash prices supposed to be falling next year it would be nice to be able to build an all-flash prosumer class home server/NAS without the spaghetti of SATA and power cablingLonyo - Saturday, August 18, 2018 - link
Cabling does allow more flexibility in case design though, and also in using the slots for other things. If you want you can connect a 3.5" drive or 2.5" drive (SSD or mechanical) to the same port, which provides far more flexibility for consumer use/construction. If you want lots of flash storage, is there a problem loading up with PCIe drives or PCIe adapters for M2 devices?Lonyo - Saturday, August 18, 2018 - link
https://www.pcgamer.com/asus-has-a-motherboard-tha...CheapSushi - Friday, August 17, 2018 - link
I love when stuff like this happens. It's not often that new form factors get teased out with everyone having an idea of what it should or could be.Samus - Friday, August 17, 2018 - link
The problem is the inferior but less expensive technology always wins...at least in the consumer space.dark4181 - Friday, August 17, 2018 - link
I honestly don't think that'll happen this time. There are a lot of tech companies on board with Gen Z, and the trends in the industry are toward open systems. I'm hopeful that this will win out. Granted, at the consumer level it'll take 5-10 years, but I'd expect infrastructure level to be 2-3 years (based on my limited knowledge and speculation.)takeshi7 - Friday, August 17, 2018 - link
And I'm just waiting for normal consumer PCIe x8 SSDs to become a common form factor since many motherboards split the PCIe lanes into x8/x8.Billy Tallis - Friday, August 17, 2018 - link
It's never going to happen. M.2 is limited to x4, so nobody is going to make a consumer-oriented controller that supports x8, especially not with the transition to PCIe gen4 starting (sooner for SSD controllers than for x86 CPUs). Also, there are plenty of motherboards that offer x8/x4/x4 splits.dark4181 - Friday, August 17, 2018 - link
I'm with Billy on this, especially with the shift to NVMe and next gen media.Since NVMe doesn't use a separate controller, but goes through the CPU. I think eventually we'll see SFF-TA-1006 filter all the way down (they're about the same dimensions as M.2). Gen Z will solve the PCIe issue you mentioned. As they said in the article, a single Gen Z lane carries more bandwidth than PCIe3 (and 4, too).edzieba - Saturday, August 18, 2018 - link
"Since NVMe doesn't use a separate controller, but goes through the CPU"NVMe SSDs still need a controller.
Billy Tallis - Saturday, August 18, 2018 - link
NVMe SSDs don't need to connect through a host bus adapter like SAS and SATA SSDs. Everything needs a controller on the drive itself, but only PCIe SSDs can connect directly to the CPU.iwod - Saturday, August 18, 2018 - link
We have a roadmap reaching 10PB per U in 2025, that is 420PB in one Rack. Compared to HDD Roadmap of 0.48PB per U in 2025.At what point, do the density, power, speed, latency improvement cross the threshold that it makes sense to go all NAND.
surt - Saturday, August 18, 2018 - link
Depends on who you are and your workload. My org hasn't bought a spinning disk in 2 years.Xajel - Saturday, August 18, 2018 - link
All I hope is a next generation consumer storage cables (SATA successor) will be able to support both SATA and PCIe storage and includes power in the same cable at least for regular NVMe & SATA SSD's..And to make it compact and tidy not like those stupid drive-side U.2 connectors.. or motherboad side PCIe Express slot.
eek2121 - Saturday, August 18, 2018 - link
IMO the sizes and connector should be standardized across server as well as workstation/desktops. That will bring the lowest pricing for all. Of course, we know that'll never happen...TrevorH - Saturday, August 18, 2018 - link
The nice thing about standards is that you have so many to choose from. (Andrew S. Tanenbaum)wumpus - Tuesday, August 21, 2018 - link
You didn't think Intel could get away with "One Ruler to rule them all" did you? I'd think twice before fallowing Intel's lead in standards, they aren't nvidia, but they love nothing more than to own the market.0ldman79 - Saturday, August 18, 2018 - link
Ironically I think the growth of SSD is going to increase storage density once the prices get better.Looking at that hot swap for those new cards, 2TB+ (just a guess) per card, 16 cards fitting in the same space as a 3.5 mechanical drive...
Drazick - Sunday, August 19, 2018 - link
Give us more U.2 drives.The M.2 form doesn't make sense for Desktop Computer.
We want U.2 without all the throttling.
Billy Tallis - Sunday, August 19, 2018 - link
The window of opportunity for U.2 in the consumer space has closed. M.2 is good enough for almost all consumer storage needs, and U.2 isn't going to stick around forever in the datacenter.And you already have M.2 without all the throttling. It's called M.2.
boozed - Sunday, August 19, 2018 - link
But does the long quad M.2 bend?!?!SquarePeg - Sunday, August 19, 2018 - link
I understand that I'm probably in the minority here but I really wish they made hot swappable compact flash sized micro SSD's that are fast enough to saturate a USB 3.1 bus.Dug - Monday, August 20, 2018 - link
They really just need a fast external connection for servers so you separate cpu/memory from storage. And get rid of 1U/2U form factor! It's so inefficient for just about everything.